FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
Back to site

Crimping connectors with Tyco Electronics Pro-Crimper III

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    EFI University Forum Index -> MoTeC
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Hugh



Joined: 03 Dec 2005
Posts: 426
Location: Scotland

PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2012 1:51 pm    Post subject: Crimping connectors with Tyco Electronics Pro-Crimper III Reply with quote

Hi Guy's,

Am preparing myself to build a loom in my track car.

M600 + ADL2 + SKM + traction etc etc.

Have seen Figgie posting on the Supra Forum that the Tyco Electronics Pro-Crimper III is the best tool for the job.

I have not bought the wire for the loom yet, can anyone recommend a good source for lightweight wire and also advise the die that I will need for the wire.

I have crimped Motec terminals before with the wrong crimper and it is a nightmare to insert the terminals into the connectors.

I have a lightweight loom from a GP bike that uses Raychem wire, it is a work of art, but no idea how they put it all together with boots over every junction and heatshrink over every wire run, so a complete guide would not go amiss if such a thing exists.

I will probably butcher the bike loom for it's connectors and useable wire, but will still have lots to do.

Thanks

Hugh
_________________
R32 GTR Nissan Skyline Race Car+ twin HKS 3037S
OS Giken 3 litre block + OS Giken sequential
Hopefully Motec M1 ECU
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
stevieturbo



Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1235
Location: Norn Iron

PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

re-crimpers....may be of some use. Seems very difficult to find the right tool, and even harder a suitable tool at a sensible price.

http://www.dtaforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=16

As for layout, lots of forward planning and patience routing the bare wires where they need to go, then sleeving/shrinking and terminating.
_________________
got blown

9.85 @ 144.75mph
202mph standing mile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgWRCDtiTQ0
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Roberto Arano



Joined: 22 Nov 2005
Posts: 503
Location: colorado

PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2012 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

will any of these work? :

http://www.bmotorsports.com/shop/index.php/cPath/111_112
_________________
www.circuitse7en.net
http://stores.ebay.com/Circuit-Se7en

it's named efi UNIVERSITY not efi "Bragging" Smile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
stevieturbo



Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1235
Location: Norn Iron

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Problem seems to be that there are so many crimpers, but it's the "barrel" round crimp the ecu connectors use that makes it more difficult.

Many come close, but few get it just right. Best to call and ask them to be sure before spending.

The Knipex setup in my other link is the correct tool, and has interchangeable jaws.
As to how good it is, I dont know though.
_________________
got blown

9.85 @ 144.75mph
202mph standing mile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgWRCDtiTQ0
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Hugh



Joined: 03 Dec 2005
Posts: 426
Location: Scotland

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 3:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stevie

Thanks for the link, the first guy seemed to get good results with a very basic crimper.

http://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Delphi-Connection-Systems/12085271/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMvlX3nhDDO4AMs0RBa484%252b0yU4Ze%2FcEpWw%3D

Still reading the thread.




Thanks guys, perhaps it would be easier if we identified the connector pins and the dimensions so that the crimp details can be verified.

Reason I mentioned Figgie above is that he used to build aircraft harnesses and has plenty of experience with Motec.

Can anyone provide a link to the pin drawing? it might be easier to select a crimper if we knew the exact details of the crimp terminal connector pins.

Thanks

Hugh
_________________
R32 GTR Nissan Skyline Race Car+ twin HKS 3037S
OS Giken 3 litre block + OS Giken sequential
Hopefully Motec M1 ECU
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
stevieturbo



Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1235
Location: Norn Iron

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have a look on the dta forum. Past nos for the pins was given just the other day. Or the dta manual lists them at the back for a couple of cable sizes.
_________________
got blown

9.85 @ 144.75mph
202mph standing mile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgWRCDtiTQ0
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
stevieturbo



Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1235
Location: Norn Iron

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

M-cal sell the correct tool too
_________________
got blown

9.85 @ 144.75mph
202mph standing mile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgWRCDtiTQ0
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Hugh



Joined: 03 Dec 2005
Posts: 426
Location: Scotland

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 7:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For the record, here are the pins to fit the MXXX ECU's http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/crimp-terminals/6809705/

Here is a drawing showing the pin dimensions.

http://docs-europe.electrocomponents.com/webdocs/0db0/0900766b80db0933.pdf

Surely we can find a crimper that matches the dimensions shown on the above drawing.
_________________
R32 GTR Nissan Skyline Race Car+ twin HKS 3037S
OS Giken 3 litre block + OS Giken sequential
Hopefully Motec M1 ECU
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
stevieturbo



Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1235
Location: Norn Iron

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DTA lists part nos as

3-1447221-3 and 3-1447221-4

http://uk.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=MvPdH6bTHujBOZcRbVlrYA%3d%3d

Seems for two diff wire sizes

Wire Range = 0.75-1.25? [18-16] mm [AWG]
http://www.te.com/catalog/pn/en/3-1447221-3

Wire Range = 0.50-0.60? [20] mm [AWG]
http://www.te.com/catalog/pn/en/3-1447221-4

Some googling reveals these. Contact them to ensure the item is right first though;. Many other ecu's use these same ecu plugs/pins these days

http://store.apexspeedtech.com/motec-universal-open-barrel-crimp-tool

http://www.m-cal.com/Products/MC70-368073/MoTec-Military-Crimp-Tool-(fits-all-MoTec-Mil-Type-Pins)

Some interesting looking ones here.

http://whiteproducts.com/cetools.shtml

Another guy makes reference to these being suitable

http://www.king-cart.com/cgi-bin/cart.cgi?store=phoenixent&product_name=HWS16166

or definitely the right tool. Their price isnt too bad either compared to some

http://shop.durbahn.de/shop/en/products/Wire_harness_%26_Tools/Crimptools

Given how popular these connectors are, it does amaze how difficult it is to find a sensibly priced crimp tool
_________________
got blown

9.85 @ 144.75mph
202mph standing mile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgWRCDtiTQ0
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
stevieturbo



Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1235
Location: Norn Iron

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some pics of a loom under construction....and some budget crimpers in the background ? Might be worth asking him Hugh ? He tends to know about Motec stuff ;)

Post 36, loom being made by a man who clearly knows how to !

http://www.lancerregister.com/showthread.php?t=400801&page=3

I'll pinch the image links and put them here, hopefully they'll work

http://www.lancerregister.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=199826&stc=1&d=1326752485

http://www.lancerregister.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=199827&stc=1&d=1326752485

http://www.lancerregister.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=199828&stc=1&d=1326752485

http://www.lancerregister.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=199829&stc=1&d=1326752485
_________________
got blown

9.85 @ 144.75mph
202mph standing mile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgWRCDtiTQ0
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Hugh



Joined: 03 Dec 2005
Posts: 426
Location: Scotland

PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 12:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve,

Thanks for all the links.

I really like the look anf price of the

http://www.king-cart.com/cgi-bin/cart.cgi?store=phoenixent&product_name=HWS16166



Thanks for the links to the Audi from EPS, have not seen that car for a few years, it used to sit in Motec UK workshop, Dave Rowe used to work at Motec before he set up on his own, I have used him many times to help set-up my car.

He is a great guy, he will build a loom for you, but not so easy to help you do your own.
_________________
R32 GTR Nissan Skyline Race Car+ twin HKS 3037S
OS Giken 3 litre block + OS Giken sequential
Hopefully Motec M1 ECU
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
stevieturbo



Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1235
Location: Norn Iron

PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 2:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ive seen a few crimpers state open barrel and for D-sub connectors like the text in that link etc, so dont think you'd need to buy from the US to get one.

It is still difficult to see just how round the actual crimp hole is in those jaws. Certainly couldnt be a mile off though.

When I made mine, must admit I was just crude and squished mine with small pliers and soldered then

I removed the weather seal from the connector which made insertion easier, although some of the back casing did need relieved on the heavier power wiring pins. My ecu will never see anything other than a dry environment anyway

Similar appearance, but still difficult to tell.

http://www.kustompcs.co.uk/acatalog/info_1993.html

Or give these people a shout ?

http://www.thecrimpcompany.com/scpro/crimp/products/productssubshowtools.asp?page=1&parentcatname=CRIMPING%20Tools&parentcat=62&prodname=Tools%20for%20Un-Insulated%20Terminals&prodcategory=2&id=2&subtool=2

( Ive just emailed them )

Might do no harm to give Dave a call anyway though, he may sell a crimper ?
_________________
got blown

9.85 @ 144.75mph
202mph standing mile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgWRCDtiTQ0
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Hugh



Joined: 03 Dec 2005
Posts: 426
Location: Scotland

PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 4:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for that.

It may seem contra intuitive, but soldering is a complete no no when it comes to wiring looms.

I came upon this a few years ago when making looms for tools that work in the high vibration environment involved in downhole drilling tools.

We used an aircraft crimp that was stronger than the wire when the connector is installed.

Cheers

Hugh
_________________
R32 GTR Nissan Skyline Race Car+ twin HKS 3037S
OS Giken 3 litre block + OS Giken sequential
Hopefully Motec M1 ECU
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
stevieturbo



Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1235
Location: Norn Iron

PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 5:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I fully agree, but in my case a decent solder was better than a terrible crimp, as I don't have a proper crimper.
_________________
got blown

9.85 @ 144.75mph
202mph standing mile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgWRCDtiTQ0
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
IJ.



Joined: 10 May 2007
Posts: 75

PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hugh wrote:
Steve,

Thanks for all the links.

I really like the look anf price of the

http://www.king-cart.com/cgi-bin/cart.cgi?store=phoenixent&product_name=HWS16166



Thanks for the links to the Audi from EPS, have not seen that car for a few years, it used to sit in Motec UK workshop, Dave Rowe used to work at Motec before he set up on his own, I have used him many times to help set-up my car.

He is a great guy, he will build a loom for you, but not so easy to help you do your own.

The main difference I can see to the Tyco/MoTeC Crimper is a lack of the 2 alignment pins per Die that are held down with the Centre Screw Hugh, as I mentioned on the MoTeC Forum the DIES interchange to my Generic MSD crimper but I'm assuming the pins are there for a reason as the MoTec/Tyco connector is very fussy re pins insertion/removal.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
figgie



Joined: 02 May 2006
Posts: 354

PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hugh

best tool for the Job..

depends on what job ;)

I would not use the Pro-Crimp on say Mil-C-38999 connectors.

with that said, I will have to dig through my notes. I recalled that the MoTeC connector was a AMP (now tyco) connector and I have X-refernce the Crimp die to use specifically for those barel connectors. It will take me some time too look for that though. Sad
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
MrDomino



Joined: 01 Oct 2009
Posts: 190
Location: Indianapolis, IN

PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are there any guides/how tos on how to make a decent wiring loom?
_________________
I am a Mechanical Engineer.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    EFI University Forum Index -> MoTeC All times are GMT - 7 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group

©2007 EFI University
Website designed and maintained by 3LizardsMedia.com