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Vane dynos
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bill



Joined: 29 Jul 2007
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 10:10 pm    Post subject: Vane dynos Reply with quote

Anyone has any info on 4000 series?

Specs?
Roller diameter?

Anyone used or uses one?

I know they are old but I know they are still used in AU.
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awddynotodd



Joined: 21 Oct 2006
Posts: 290
Location: Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you get one that is working, go for it, if it's not, there is no one who can fix them, (or willing to fix them) as there is no parts available for them as they are 20-30 years old.

Roller Diameters are around 266mm to 270.

Retarders are either CC120, CC135 or in rare cases CC160 in VP950 models.

Vane 4000/950 beds are a good candidates for upgrades.
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bill



Joined: 29 Jul 2007
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 6:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Todd,
Thanks for reply.
I was thinking of buying a working one and upgrade it with a modern control system.
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gtodesign



Joined: 21 Jul 2008
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry to inerrupt but I was wondering what you had on mind for for the modern control system? I'm in the throws of upgrading an old chassis dyno myself at the moment.
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Warpspeed



Joined: 05 Jun 2006
Posts: 553
Location: Melbourne

PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The control system is the problem, you will have to design and build something yourself entirely from scratch.

The dyno monitoring is far easier, because there are several commercial software packages around, along with the associated hardware and interfaces to make it all work.
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gtodesign



Joined: 21 Jul 2008
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 4:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Control system isn't necessarily a problem...

Depends what sort of control system you want. If you want a manually variable load on the brake, you can easily make something yourself. If you want closed loop control and computer controlled ramp rate there are aftermarket control systems from the likes of sportdevices or land-and-sea.
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bill



Joined: 29 Jul 2007
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi gtodesign,
I had sportdevices, land&sea and tat in my mind.
Have you contacted anyone? Prices?
What dyno are you upgrading?
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gtodesign



Joined: 21 Jul 2008
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just fitted a Sportdevices SP3 to a Sun Ram 12 with manual (electronic) brake controller, was about EUR1600 might upgrade later to SP4 but it jumps up to EUR4200.

Looked at TAT but IIRC there was quite a jump in price.

Spent the last day setting up, testing and calibrating.
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bill



Joined: 29 Jul 2007
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let us know how it works!
Some pictures or videos would be great also.
Where are you located?
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gtodesign



Joined: 21 Jul 2008
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hampshire UK. It's all in the floor and working already, just doing final setup, testing and calibration really. Will try and get some pics sorted out.
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limited cv8r



Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

both dyno dynamics and mainline can supply upgraded control systems, but they are not cheap though. With a bit of time and effort you can have a nice dyno. I upgraded an old VP-950 with a CC160 retarder. I believe the older dynos are a lot stronger built plus they have the larger 270mm diameter and longer rollers. I have some pics but don't know how to post them.
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Glenno



Joined: 06 May 2009
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2009 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does anyone have the circuit digrams for a VP950 I have one that I need to get going again. The auto mode keeps goign to full load and inspection of the circuit board shows several unhealthy looking capacitiors that I can't ID.

Considering building a control and monitoring setup for it but I would really need the circuit digrams and information for it or at least the specs of the load cell and retarder.
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Glenno



Joined: 06 May 2009
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whats the easiest way to find out what retarder is in this bed. Only thing i can see on the rotors is AEASA and SM101
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limited cv8r



Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

These usually run a telma retarder. On the main frame that goes around the retarder there should be a small tag riveted on with a CC- number stamped into it. Common sizes are CC-160 and CC-125.
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merlin



Joined: 03 Jun 2006
Posts: 93
Location: Melbourne Australia

PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a vane vp950

I upgraded it to a load cell and speed sensor that is logged into a MoTeC ADL a few years ago ...as most of the cars I run are Rotary circut race car it copes well

mine Has a telma 30 retarder ...any one have any ideas on there specs

I have just aquired another retarder and intend to make mine a dual retarder


John P
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Glenno



Joined: 06 May 2009
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 3:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is the retarder in our VP950 bed, can't find a tag on it as of yet.


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awddynotodd



Joined: 21 Oct 2006
Posts: 290
Location: Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 4:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glenno wrote:
This is the retarder in our VP950 bed, can't find a tag on it as of yet.


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It is a CC135.
Any reason your trying to identify it?
FYI, the Telma agent in Australia say coils for CC135's are no longer available, so we have our own made and stock these when we do a refurb of these old things and there is a dodgy coil.
We bought some CC160 coils a couple of years ago and it appeared we took all the stock of these as well.
All newer Telma Retarders are now a different design, so probably the new coils don't fit the older Retarders.
We now stock complete bolt in Replacement Frenelsa retarders for when we upgrade these VP950's. Most of the time these old dyno's have been lying around for a while not being used and the dyno pits are full of water, so normally most of the coils are faulty or have excessive insulation leakage which is no good if you expect to get any further useful life out of them.
[img][/img]
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Glenno



Joined: 06 May 2009
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 5:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looking to ID it to see what I can do in regard to upgrading it with a Land and See upgrade. The dyno currently works with an old analogue cabinet but without logging ability it really limits what we can do with it.

A friend upgraded a similar bed with land and sea gear and loves it.

For around $10k AUD I can land the gear here to upgrade it where everyone in AU wants $25k +
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awddynotodd



Joined: 21 Oct 2006
Posts: 290
Location: Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glenno wrote:
Looking to ID it to see what I can do in regard to upgrading it with a Land and See upgrade. The dyno currently works with an old analogue cabinet but without logging ability it really limits what we can do with it.

A friend upgraded a similar bed with land and sea gear and loves it.

For around $10k AUD I can land the gear here to upgrade it where everyone in AU wants $25k +


You don't need to ID the Retarder to do any Upgrade, a Retarder is a Retarder.
It's knowing the peculiararities of each Retarder that saves you the time and money when dealing with someone who knows the machine.
I know of people who have gone down the 10K path only to blow Retarder coils one after the other, and then ring us up and ask what they are doing wrong...
When we do an upgrade, while it is maybe 3 times the price of of the overseas option, you get someone who turns up, does the upgrade, trains you, warrants the work, provide after sales service and ongoing training, and you have a system that has the capability of a brand new dyno, with the dyno control system and PC etc all housed in a a dedicated Cabinet with Fan Switchgear etc all included. There is a reason why some systems cost more, unfortunately the people who are just after the lowest price fail to completely research the differences, and end up spending it all again if it doesn't work out the first time going the cheap way.
If you're a tinkerrer in a farm shed, then go the 10K option, but if your a professional workshop, credibility of the product you have goes a long way when you're starting out in the world of dyno tuning as to who will spend money with you.
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dkGoodrich dot com



Joined: 18 May 2010
Posts: 169
Location: Frankfort KY

PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 1:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spending 10-20k on a old dyno seems retarded considering how much they are selling new 2wd load dynos for.

Check out mustang dynes or land and sea, from my research they seem to have the lowest prices.

I've seen first hand how much capital you can build with either, and a 20k investment now for a brand new one is nothing considering how fast you can get it back. I made my full dyne investment back in less than 3 months. Keep in mind, I'm tuning on it, its very rare I sell just 3 pulls. My dyne prices are also cheapest in ky. I think it would have been a stupid investment for me if I wasn't tuning on it.

I didn't finance mine but mustang has a finance program that is very easy and just requires money down and insurance. Most of the other dyne manufactures required much more when I was considering financing.

Hope this helps,
Dk
_________________
http://www.dkGoodrich.com
Professional Dyno Tuning Services
Mustang 10' 2WD & 14' AWD dyno in a cell
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